HomeHumorBill Maher Educates TEApublicans About The Founding Fathers – MUST WATCH!

Bill Maher Educates TEApublicans About The Founding Fathers – MUST WATCH!

This is one of Bill Maher’s best monologues ever!  “I want you teabaggers out there to understand one thing: while you idolize the Founding Fathers and dress up like them, and smell like them, I think it’s pretty clear that the Founding Fathers would have hated your guts,” Maher said.   This is an important video to share on the heels of Grover Norquist’s threat that “Tea Party #2″ is coming!

About AATTP

AATTP
Americans Against The Tea Party is a group committed to exposing the Tea Party’s lies, violence, racism, ignorance, intolerance, bigotry, and corporatist fascist efforts to subvert our democratic process – and we are organizing to defeat Tea Party/GOP candidates on ballots everywhere.
  • El Silverdawg

    It’s Bill Maher for cryin’ out loud.
    Who takes him seriously?
    Him, Jon Stewart, Steven Cobert are merely entertainers that appeal to a certain juvenile mind-set and make their living reading other peoples material to sell commercials

  • lynnguist

    Yikes, It’s not even an original rewrite

  • John Carollo

    These “non-fact” checkers always have to say what they want, not what is true. Makes them seem erudite.

  • John Carollo

    There was a Greek mystery play, “Iesus and His Twelve Constellations” … sounds familiar? AND it has the key to the astrological basis of the New Testament … so why are we doing the Dan Quayle thing and historicizing fiction (remember his rants against single-motherhood’s Murphy Brown?).

  • Highlander

    They get called teabaggers because they came up with e name themselves, before they realized the negative connotation to the term.

  • sickofthedisciples

    i don’t think mahar cares about the attention.
    The truth was, the constitution was the aca of it’s day. there was a great deal of effort to get the needed support to assure it’s passage and a great number of founders actually voted against it, including patrick henry. the 3/5′s clause and many other slave provisions were written in to secure the passage in southern states.

  • sickofthedisciples

    funny stuff…

  • JohnnyS

    What scares me more then anything, is the continued deterioration of the separation of state and religion in this country.

    On a personal level I am not a christian or any of the major organized religions of the world. I find them hypocritical. Yet I do believe in a higher power, that may be a she or a he.

    One of the greatest lines in a movie is in Kingdom of heaven.

    THE KING
    A King may move a man…a father
    may claim a son…a man may move
    himself…and then the man begins
    his own game. Remember howsoever
    you are played, or by whom, that
    your soul is in your keeping. Even
    though those who presume to play
    you be kings. Remember.

    When you answer to God you cannot
    say “I was told it was thus”, or
    that virtue “was not the fashion of
    my times”. Remember.

    This what I take from what the founding fathers were enlighten enough to understand. That god, he or even she resides in each and everyone of us. That are own moral code and conscious is what should guide us. Not a institution(s) that are more political then truly religious.

    Of course I do have this vision of Teapublicans before god, whining Beck told us to do it.

  • https://www.facebook.com/gael2sail Liam Mykael O’Sruitheain

    Bill Maher is so full of shit and his own arrogance it is all coming out of his mouth.

    My own university career has been in history. I have studied American, European and Ottoman history all of my life.

    When Bill Maher has the audacity to claim or imply that the majority of the Founding Fathers thought the Bible is “Bullshit”, the only thing that Maher is proving is that he himself is full of bullshit and doesn’t know what he is talking about.

    There is not enough time here to itemize all of his bullshit. However, I can easily recommend just one book that will prove his claims are bullshit. It is titled: AMERICA’S GOD AND COUNTRY ……. Encyclopedia of Quotations …. by William J. Federer. It is a book of voluminous documented quotations from the Founding Fathers and other prominent American leaders up to the modern era …. detailing their religious convictions and belief in the essential moral legitimacy of the Christian code and their belief that the Bible was Divinely inspired.

    By the way …. I am NOT a Christian. So, no one can claim that I have a Christian bias. I am simply stating what is historical fact. Of course there were a few prominent citizens involved in the American War of Independence who were Deists …. along with the occasional atheist. But for Maher to suggest that the majority of the Founding Fathers believed the Bible to be “Bullshit” is a flat out LIE. Even some of those who considered themselves to be mainstream Christian did not necessarily interpret every word of the Bible in a LITERAL fashion …. but that does not mean that they did not believe in its essential moral worth. Many of the Founding Fathers WERE critical of the way that “Christians” of their day BEHAVED. They were critical of the hypocrisy and corruption of some religious figures …. and some “Christian” INSTITUTIONAL practices. They wanted reforms …. and a return to the essential morality of the teachings of Christ.

    Anyone can take selective quotes out of a larger context in order to claim a false premise about a particular person or group of people, but people are FULL of contradictions …. and the things they say will vary and change throuhout the course of their life. George Washington, John Adams, James Madison, and later …. Abraham Lincoln, etc. were PERSONALLY very devout men. Yet, they were also critical of religious INSTITUTIONS …. and the behavior of many in the clergy. They did NOT want to create a theocracy …. and for a very good reason: they knew that a theocracy would make it easier for a future tyranny to take hold. Not wanting a theocracy does not mean, however, that they were personally lacking in religious faith.

    • https://www.facebook.com/robert.scalzi Robert Scalzi

      You are delusional

    • https://www.facebook.com/don.ferestad Don Ferestad

      Liam, I understand the meaning of your name and that I find refreshing. I enjoyed your well versed opinion of Bill Mahers and his personal attack on American history and our founding fathers. I will be reading “America’s God and Country.

    • https://www.facebook.com/jonas.bird Jonas Bird

      I think that the video is an oversimplification made for TV. It is also far closer to the historical facts then the Fox News version of pious founding fathers and pilgrims creating a nation to defend Christendom from other religions. I would also guess you understand this and are attacking his rhetorical flourishes as if they were statements of fact in order to bolster the claims of the religious conservative crowd. The fact remains that the founding fathers would be horrified by the degree that personal belief is now a requirement in political life, and would see the Teabaggers as a clear and present danger with their faith based policies.

    • Carla Stixs

      You do realize Bill Maher is a comedian.

      • John Carollo

        Obviously not. But Dan Quayle didn’t realize Murphy Brown was a character on a sitcom either … when he condemned her “single mother” parenthood!

    • John Carollo

      I thought the Founding Fathers were Deists … a far cry from the Bible Belters.

  • Pingback: Hey Tea Party: If You Think America Is A 'Christian Nation' - THINK AGAIN! - Americans Against the Tea Party

  • Timothy

    Where is my video response AATP Author. Argument aint fair if only you are able to post “bs.”

  • Timothy

    This kills half of you argument at least. He is proving what I am saying. All “ancient” historical figures are subject to the same scrutiny as you guys scrutinize Jesus. But you have no problem believing the accounts of Julius Caesar, Brutus, Marc Anthony.

    • PaulOnBooks

      I think you’ll find that Julius Caesar isn’t worshipped by many – more especially, he isn’t used as an excuse for all sorts of vile prejudice. Nor is there an Old Roman Testament.

    • Highlander

      Were any of those people having claims made about them that they could raise the dead, heal the sick, walk on water, etc?

    • Raymond Robertson

      Of course people believe in Caesar, Brutus, Marc Anthony, as many of their contemporaries wrote about them and they are in the Roman records of the time. No contemporary historian at the time Jesus supposedly lived mentions him, not even the ones who wrote of the uprisings and unrest in Judea. In fact, no one writes about Jesus until after Paul and Luke get their hooks into Christianity and take it over about 70 years after Jesus supposedly died.

      • John Carollo

        And there were some pretty good yellow/gossiping historians around at that time … how did a purge of first born boys miss getting noticed? Suetonius was the Walter Cronkite of his day … hmmm, maybe that Bible is full of junk science as well?

  • Timothy

    BTW let me inform you guys that being that I am black I dont give a lovely about the so called “founding fathers” or what they believe. I know they held my people as slaves.so the tea party fox news and whoever else that try to convince me that this is a christian nation will get an argument out of me as well. I support the truth of the Bible, not the murderous thieving fathers. There is no christian nation.

    • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

      How short your memory. Or did you forget that the Bible condones slavery, and instructs slave owners and slaves how to behave toward one another? A black christian is a person with no sense of history.

      • Timothy

        I repeat. I am a theology student. I know how the Bible has been misused by ignorant white men. My sense of history surpasses yours I’m sure pastor.

        • PaulOnBooks

          Your race, creed and occupation seem to change to meet the needs of your replies. Are you sure you’re not just a little confused?

    • RichardR

      Really, you don’t care about the founders? Seems like you care about Bill Maher caring about them:

      Timothy: “If any of you can prove to me the method by which Bill Maher came to the conclusion that the founding fathers thought the bible was bs, and that this method is any different from my proof that it is not, please step forward or forever hold your peace.”

      That whole conversation came up because you asked how valid historical evidence is any different than a book that most 6th grade history teachers wouldn’t accept as a valid reference. You tried to use a bad argument to make an invalid point, and now, all the sudden, you “don’t care about the founding fathers?” Yeah. It’s pretty clear that you asked for an education on rational methodology and historical validity, and you got it.

      By the way, it’s blacks like you who are giving Teabaggers all the ammunition they need to say that blacks are too stupid to lead their own culture. They may pay you lip service by pretending to support the bible, but down deep they’re laughing at anyone who needs the Bible to support his arguments. You’re helping to turn your culture into the ignorant, irrational peasant class that they want you to be. They’re using God to manipulate the gullible, and you’re playing right into it. As far as I’m concerned, you’re nothing more than a traitor to yourself, your family and your race.

      • Timothy

        Richard R said “They’re using God to manipulate the gullible, and you’re playing right into it. As far as I’m concerned, you’re nothing more than a traitor to yourself, your family and your race.”

        Making personal attacks? I guess you’re mad now huh. Yet the moderator allows you to use my race as a point of attack. I assume you are white. I could go there with you but I will respect those who wish not to stoop so low. But the bottom line is that all of ancient history when scrutinized and evaluated equally requires a measure of faith in the documents available. The Bible has been used by many as a source of history. The guy in the video that the Author provided proves this point in a separate video called Atheist Myth: “Jesus is not a historical figure” – Debunked by AGNOST. Check it out on Youtube. It proves what I have been saying all along. You can’t call people ignorant based on the fact that they believe in a documents worth. All historians do it. Even you.

        • RichardR

          Call it a personal attack if you want to…I call it an observation based on reasoned conclusion. If it seems like an attack, it’s because you’re on the wrong side of logic. AATP knows damn good and well that I’m not afraid to speak my mind when I’m following a line of logic. Speaking of which:

          “The bottom line is that all of ancient history when scrutinized and evaluated equally requires a measure of faith in the documents available.” Yes, and that’s exactly why we avoid making absolute statements about history when the document in question is A) Not corroborated by any external source, B) Wasn’t written by contemporaries and C) Was assembled not as an objective historical document, but as ideological propaganda designed to reinforce claims to power. The simple fact is that if moses hadn’t spun a story about the Jews being the chosen people, then Joshua couldn’t have justified committing genocide to take over Canaan. Since then, the church has done nothing but cherrypick documents to solidify claims and enhance their own international power base. Of course, there are good and useful ideologies in the Bible…but those are just the buttercream frosting on a cake make of shit.

          Granted, a LOT of historical documents are one-sided propaganda. History is written by the winners. But that’s why we question those things and don’t take everything they say as gospel. Please, do feel free to tell me why, for some reason, the Bible is the ONLY ancient propaganda that is somehow not subject to the same rules of verity as any other.

    • Raymond Robertson

      “I support the truth of the Bible, not the murderous thieving fathers. ”
      Really? I doubt you’ve ever really read the Bible itself, or you would have realized that it is VERY supportive of slavery, both the Old and New Testaments, and in the New, instructs slaves to obey their masters and not rebel against them.

  • Timothy

    Sooo I thought the conversation was over since you guys would not address the issue I brought up.I am not here to prove nothing but the fallacy of you guys logic when it pertains to proof of history. I see not even AATP author can speak on the subject of the method we use to prove historical events. So I will just pat myself on the back for that one. I won’t view your video until you can address my question. What proof does B. Maher have that the fathers considered the bible bs? If you cant address your own video, then the only bs is the video itself because it can’t be defended.

    • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

      The proof you keep asking for has been provided in reply to you as many times as you have requested it. You can even find the quotes we’ve provided directly in the hand-written letters and diaries of the authors themselves.

      As for logical fallacy, you have committed so many in your “arguments” that you are a waste of time and effort, and are a troll by definition. Any further comments from you will be ignored.

      Now kindly bugger off.

      • Timothy

        “The proof you keep asking for has been provided in reply to you as many times as you have requested it. You can even find the quotes we’ve provided directly in the hand-written letters and diaries of the authors themselves.” – No More Mythology

        I know right. Thats what I wanted you to do. My point was to prove that you depend on documents and letters to validate history. The Bible that Maher says is bs is a collection of letters that believers use to validate biblical history. You put your faith in what certain men have endorsed to push a particular idea. We do the same. We all do it.

        • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

          The difference is that my sources are first-hand accounts, in the handwriting of the authors, compared to several other documents known to have also been written by those same men.

          The Bible is all second and third and fourth hand accounts written by largely unknown authors in a time when similar stories had been told aurally before being written. It’s like playing a game of telephone thousands deep. Appealing to authority (“The bible is the word of god because the bible says so.”) doesn’t get around this very important difference between your “evidence” and the historically accurate, verifiable quote list that was given you as proof of what the founders of our nation said about God, the Bible, and religion in general.

          And you’re just pissed that Maher makes a valid argument.

          • John Carollo

            Not to mention all the “lost in translation” errors … try translating anything on the Times Best Seller list into any of today’s modern languages and see how that works for you.

        • http://gravatar.com/sinistar99 sinistar99

          That’s true, but we’ve got more than just blind faith in some documents. We have logic and common sense and the ability to piece together documents and clues left by many disperate sources… like detectives at the scene of the crime. A preponderence of evidence doesn’t require an ounce of faith.

          The same science that we use to figure out what the atmosphere of io is made of without sending a probe there works for history. If relationships are predictive then we go with them until they’re not.

          Besides, nothing in the founding father’s writings or in our belief about their intentions violates the laws of physics or asks us to believe in magic trees or talking snakes or flaming swords or that a person lived for days inside a whale. Comparing our belief in well established observable repeatable historical events to fairy tales is well… not a good comparison.

  • Timothy

    Amazing how we got off subject here. But if AATP will allow me. If any of you can prove to me the method by which Bill Maher came to the conclusion that the founding fathers thought the bible was bs, and that this method is any different from my proof that it is not, please step forward or forever hold your peace.

    • RichardR

      Maher came by his conclusions by reading books that weren’t the Bible. Remember that thing about “observable and documented reality?” I’ll post a link, but here is a (very short) list of the highlights. These are all verified, documented by contemporaries and come as direct quotes from the source, written by the person himself. None of which you can say about the Bible.

      Thomas Jefferson

      “The hocus-pocus phantasm of a God like another Cerberus, with one body and three heads, had its birth and growth in the blood of thousands and thousands of martyrs.”

      “It is too late in the day for men of sincerity to pretend they believe in the Platonic mysticisms.”

      Regarding the Jeffersonian Bible: “Jefferson was a rationalist. He believed that Jesus was a pure and ethical teacher of morals. To that end, Jefferson took a razor to the New Testament and removed passages he thought to have been inserted by the authors of the gospels (whom he called the “commentators”), and he pasted what remained together as “The Jefferson Bible”. With his razor blade, he removed every verse dealing with the virgin birth, miracles, resurrection, claims of Jesus’ divinity and other puerile superstition, thus leaving us with a very much shorter book.”

      Ben Franklin:

      “Lighthouses are more helpful than churches.”

      “”I looked around for God’s judgments, but saw no signs of them.”

      “In the affairs of the world, men are saved not by faith, but by the lack of it.”

      James Madison:

      “”Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise.”

      “The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”

      “”Experience witnesseth that ecclesiastical establishments, instead of maintaining the purity and efficacy of religion, have had a contrary operation. During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution.”

      Abraham Lincoln:

      “The Bible is not my book, nor Christianity my profession.”

      John Adams:

      “As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation. But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?”

      “The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. Nowhere in the Gospels do we find a precept for Creeds, Confessions, Oaths, Doctrines, and whole cartloads of other foolish trumpery that we find in Christianity.”

      “The question before the human race is, whether the God of Nature shall govern the world by his own laws, or whether priests and kings shall rule it by fictitious miracles?”

      “Have you considered that system of holy lies and pious frauds that has raged and triumphed for 1,500 years?”

      Thomas Paine:

      “Of all the tyrannies that affect mankind, tyranny in religion is the worst.”

      “What is it the New Testament teaches us? To believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married; and the belief of this debauchery is called faith.”

      “Take away from Genesis the belief that Moses was the author, on which only the strange belief that it is the word of God has stood, and there remains nothing of Genesis but an anonymous book of stories, fables, and traditionary or invented absurdities, or of downright lies.”

      “I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, by the Roman Church, by the Greek Church, by the Turkish Church, by the Protestant Church, nor by any Church that I know of. My own mind is my own Church. Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all.”

      “The story of Jesus Christ appearing after he was dead is the story of an apparition, such as timid imaginations can always create in vision, and credulity believe.”

      George Washington:

      “Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by the difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be depreciated. I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society.”

      Source:
      http://freethought.mbdojo.com/foundingfathers.html

      • Timothy

        No need to post anything unless you want to get into a cut a paste contest. But you must remember that the Bible is not one letter or book. It is a collection of letters and books(scrolls) written over a thousand years apart. Yet they all collaborate with each other. The authors range from Kings to the common man. Over 44 authors from different backgrounds. All witnesses of the same truth. There is not a document in history that surpasses the greatness of the witness of Scripture. You just made my point for me. B Maher put his faith in written documents. That is no different than me putting my faith in written historical documents collected over the years to produce the most read best selling book of all time. The Bible. If the Bible was bs it wouldnt be on top of the best sellers list. People want to know God through His written word. Even you were intrigued by it being that it kept your attention for such a long period of time. In Hebrews 10:7 Jesus said

        Hebrews 10:7 (NASB)
        7 “THEN I SAID, ‘BEHOLD, I HAVE COME (IN THE SCROLL OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME) TO DO YOUR WILL, O GOD.’”

        • RichardR

          No, by all means…feel free to paste in any proof that you have that the Bible is completely historically or spiritually accurate. One rule: You can’t use anything from the Bible. You made my point exactly: It WAS written over a thousand years by 44 different people. Number 44 based his writings on numbers 1-43. Number 43 based his writings on 1-42. Number 42 based his writings on 1-41. Everyone else based everything on a hodgepodge of different religions, which Judeo-Christianity pirated from all the cultures it conquered. It’s not hard to create something cohesive-sounding if you go out of your way to hand-pick only the books that agreed with other ones (for the most part).

          Being some kind of theology student as you claim to be, you already know that The Bible was put together by the Council of Nicea from a lot of books, which were rewritten as need be to make them fit the Council’s narrative. The Bible is not and never has been some kind of Holy Revelation of books that agree because they’re all “The Truth.” The books seem to agree because the people who assembled the Bible MADE them agree. And they left out anything that didn’t fit the narrative they liked. It did NOT grow from “The Word of God”…it was absolutely an artificial construct put together by people determined to maintain power and spread the church’s influence.

          In terms of why I read it: I wanted to understand what the big deal was, and why the whole world seemed to revolve around it. Being a student of history, you can’t call yourself educated if you haven’t read the world’s most historically relevant book. And having read it, I love the Bible…particularly Judges. The whole thing reads like a Bruce Willis movie, which is great. But I’m not betting my soul or reputation on a book that was obviously corroborated, artificially constructed to meet an agenda, and has only itself to provide evidence for its own authenticity. No rational person would do that, and no rational person does.

          • Timothy

            But great universities were built in this country on the very foundation of scripture.But you know better than the founders of these universities who thought much of the authenticity of scripture. Arrogance suits you.

          • Timothy
        • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

          In Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, Harry said, “I have come to represent Dryffyndor to the face of Slytherin!”, and so he did, and he prevailed.

          Your biblical babble sounds like Harry Potter on a different drug.

        • https://www.facebook.com/jonas.bird Jonas Bird

          The frustrating thing about people like Timothy is they are incapable of seeing that the Bible is not unique. Because they accept it uncritically they can not deal with the requirement that their claims be subject to basic proof and validation. Because they have faith what they have faith in must be true… If we held Ovid or Homer to the same lack of rational thought we would have many more gods and debates over a slightly different code of behavior. If we accepted the Koran in the way they ask us to believe in the Bible our society would be different as well. Luckily a growing segment of the population believes in one fewer gods than they as Dawkin would say.

          What is infuriating is that the religious keep insisting that we not only give special consideration to their particular beliefs, but also ignore the fact that their truths have been used to justify a steady stream of barbarous atrocities and its current adherents continuously behave in a manner that runs counter to reason and ethics. Their claim to be more ‘moral’ than competing myths has not and can not be supported.

          Hopefully the current mixture of religion and politics will be broken and we can get about the business of improving our society without the constant assault on individual rights, science, and other aspects of public life, by those who feel their private myths should be forced in to our system. A system that was carefully crafted by the founding fathers to work on rationality rather then superstition. Until then the Timothys of the world will continue to try and place their personal beliefs in a privileged position in the public square and our democracy and society will need to continue and weather the storm.

          • Bob Arcter

            The funniest part is that Timothy began all this by trolling about Maher’s claim the Founding Fathers thought the bible was bullshit, and asking for his methodology…and when presented with the actual quotations from these mens’ journals and letters…he jumped into some weird debate on the authenticity of historical documents and the bible…which isn’t the point–the debate is whether or not these men thought the bible was BS…which was proven that they did.

            He gave himself away as either an idiot or a Troll when he began trying to defend the bible itself, as that wasn’t the debate. At all.

        • John Carollo

          You need to consider why those books of the Bible corroborate one another … first of all, the night all the sacred books were left on a table and the room locked so the “angels” would leave only the true books on the table top. WHO HAD THE KEYS? Secondly, much of those corroborating prophesies of Isaiah and other prophets were DOCTORED by the translators, monks, under the guidance of early Church Fathers, who needed to establish a religion their Messiah never envisioned … even if he did or did not exist.

  • Timothy

    I am not supporting the tea party. As a matter of fact I hate what they and fox news represent. I am an Obama supporter who just so happen to believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ. You people assume that all democratic voters are nonbelievers. Bill Maher has the right to insult us and on top of that these wantabee scientist ad fuel to the flames by pretending that they have the answer to the origins of life. I defend what I believe and you guys say I insult you. Well. Stop insulting us. The Bible is not bs. Bill Maher will find out soon enough on his appointed day, just like Christopher Hitchens.

    • RichardR

      “But great universities were built in this country on the very foundation of scripture.But you know better than the founders of these universities who thought much of the authenticity of scripture. Arrogance suits you.”

      Thank you. So I’ve been told. That’s true, but like most things you’ve said it’s irrelevant.

      A) Technically, the educational system as we know it was founded on the monastic tradition, which also split off to become the prison system. That’s why public school seems like jail. But monasteries became institutes of learning in order to procure funding from rich parishioners who sent their kids there to get rid of them. Universities are “rooted in scripture” because the church was the only organization at the time capable of spreading institutes of learning worldwide. And the monastic system was already in place. Education and religion has always been a marriage of convenience for money, and the only time the two have intersected is when people were willing to believe that the pursuit of truth internally was interchangeable with external observation. Regardless, it all came down to raising money for the church…it had nothing to do with the “absolute truth” of scripture.

      B) Well, that’s a cute little twist of logic, but the fact is that these people only had the information and facilities available to them at the time. When most of these universities formed, we didn’t know anything about dinosaurs, carbon dating, the atom…they used what materials they had on hand, given what was widely known or believed at the time in Europe and America. Asians, Arabs, Greeks…they all had institutes of higher learning, and none of them needed the Bible. And once secular universities started springing up after the industrial revolution, most former seminaries couldn’t drop the label fast enough. They became true institutes of learning, not Biblical indoctrination, because you eventually hit a brick wall of reason if your answer for everything comes down to “God did it.” Secular universities have never been hamstrung by ceasing in the search for truth because “God did it.”

      Point is, yes…some universities were happily religious back when they were still rooted in religion, and you didn’t need to go further than “God did it” to find your answers. Religion might have tagged along with education for a little while, because of convenience. But now, we’ve replaced God with the electron microscope, and we recognize religion as the hindrance to reason and understanding that it is.

    • https://www.facebook.com/jonas.bird Jonas Bird

      Other then your faith what basis do you keep claiming the Bible has some special answer? I could go over the difference between evolution (for all intents and purposes the study of life) and the research into the origin of life (experiments indicating that complex organic chemistry occurs under the conditions geology and chemistry show occurred existed during the period life emerged on earth) I could also point out that given the size and age of the Universe it seems inevitable that we exists despite the improbability of any one step. What confuses me -what I want to ask you about – is why you feel a need to try and claim that science is in agreement with your young earth creationist beliefs? If you take the Bible as literal truth you have no need for science. After all you are putting forward myths that fly in the face of reason as literal truth. Given that you are already standing on faith and only faith, why try and extend it into a realm, like science, where it does not belong and the foundation of your position is anathema to the attitude required. By calling creationism ID and putting it into schools people like you are exposing yourselves to ridicule, and, from my perspective, showing a desperation for validation from rationality that is impossible in this day and age. There is just too much evidence and the best attack on science I have seen amounts to outright lies or trying to draw attention to minor details that are not fully understood and using the uncertainty to claim victory without addressing real issues. Every time I see a creationist in action I can’t help but wonder how they look themselves in the mirror.

      The only reasons I can come up with for not simply ceding the domain of facts and sticking to mysticism and faith, is either a desire to force your beliefs on everyone else through the public school system (a bad idea unless you want society to lose the advantages science provides) or a fear that if the children of the faithful learn the facts behind modern science that faith will not be strong enough to keep them willfully ignorant (child abuse as far as I am concerned as well as cowardly) In either case it seems like admitting defeat morally and replacing it with a cynical need to prove the other guy wrong by outright lying to the young. Why not be honest? If getting to heaven requires giving up rationality and ignoring the world around us than your god will give the faithful the ability to purge their minds of dangerous rationality in favor of the ramblings of uneducated shepherds

      Biblical literalism and a scientific mind are incompatible. Observations about the world we live in may have not yielded perfect knowledge of every aspect of our world and the life on it, but it precludes ID. There is no controversy as to the truth of creationism, evolution is the mechanism by witch life operates, there is no multiple types of evolution, there is no evidence to back the stories in the Bible, and a well tested scientific theory – like evolution – will not be superseded. By trying to argue in this field the fundamentalists make themselves look dangerous, desperate and deranged in equal measure. Why not simply declare that the facts of science are irrelevant next to the word of god. No more outrageous statements that offend reason. No more made up facts. No more denying reality while professing to be describing it. Honesty seems like it would be more rewarding than the constant humiliation. Reasonable people would stop viewing xtians as intellectual vandals jousting at windmills they lack the intellect to understand….

      • https://www.facebook.com/jonas.bird Jonas Bird

        Also the reason why I insult x-tians is for a few simple reasons. The first is I don’t like the tendency many of them have of trying to enshrine their personal beliefs as law – for obvious reasons I hope. The second is that I feel things like ID are dishonest and try and claim mythology as science and seem to be aimed at confusing people – Americans are badly educated enough without inflaming their anti-intellectual tendencies. Third, many x-tias do not play fair. They seem to feel that their beliefs should be privileged. Pastors call for boycotts to pressure companies on the slimmest of pretexts – yet complain bitterly when the tactic is used by those they deem less worthy. Preachers call for the return of sodomy laws yet complain when they are called bigots. Church goers will happily claim all homosexuals are pedophiles yet throw tantrums if you bring up the scandals that follow high profile members of their community. Telling an atheist he should shut up is fine, but telling a minister you disapprove of his teachings and it is censorship. You (and I mean you personally Timothy, as well as others like you) believe you have special privileges in this society and take offence at not having it recognized. For instance the gleeful way you contemplate those who criticize your beliefs death – it is ugly and shows that your attitude towards those who disagree with you is based in spite. Luckily I have given up on expecting x-tians to behave in line with their beliefs, and look forward to you living an empty life based on a contemptible lie.

  • http://www.lennox.us Lennox Morey

    There is only continued time that it takes to prove by physical reality that God just isn’t going to come by your house, and since s(he) isnt, she must not want to ever be seen. So she really only chooses those for her heaven who will believe no facts over facts. if you can see that unattractive logical truth, maybe you can go on to see (with a little practice) that how to make a telescope was figured out by a human, that how to recognize input (stars for what they are) from outside the solar system was figured out over generations af trial and error rather than a momentary ‘here’s my word so get ALL the facts from here”, by god. you might even come to the REALization that the pope says hes gods mouthpiece, the bible says (in code) that im god himself, and the mormon bishop says he is one of many direct representatives of god. So listen to me little person, follow logic and learn or im going to come and ‘vindicate’ you with an asteroid.

  • William Jackson

    Dennis Therrian: I didn`t hear him saying the Bible is bulls**t. He did say that the founding fathers thought the Bible was bulls**t, and that`s true for most of them if not all.

    If that isn`t what you want to believe, then that`s exactly the point that Maher is making. If you want to know what your founding fathers believed, they deserve more than 5 minutes on Google. Go to the library and find the books and essays that they wrote.
    Most of the founding fathers were theists, but not Christians. They believed that there must be a creator, but they believed that all religions were false.

    By the way, you might find it interesting to compare the beliefs of very well educated people in the 18th century to those of very well educated people in the 2oth é 21st century. Among scientists admitted to the Academy of the Sciences, 93% do not believe in a personal god or in a life after death.
    So a lot of people do believe the Bible is bulls**t, I`m one of them and so is Maher. And so were the founding fathers, and the more highly educated a person is, the more likely they are to share that opinion.

    • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

      Well put, all the way around.

      As a former lay pastor and now atheist, I will submit that the Bible is bulls**t, and that anyone who reads it with frank skepticism, cannot help but walk away with the same conclusion. It requires a special kind of delusion for millions of people to buy into an obvious and often ridiculous bronze-age myths that were re-packaged stories from even older, stone-age myths.

      When one considers that there have been over 300,000 documented deities in human history, the notion that their particular deity is “the right one, and even the ONLY ‘true’ god” is simply devoid of any critical thinking.

      And yes, I am a vocal anti-theist.

      • RichardR

        Well, that’s the thing about it; Judeo-Christian-Muslims CAN feel justified in claiming that their personal god is the only one, because that god IS a combination of all others. The whole set of religions (particularly Christianity) spread not by replacing other religions, but by absorbing them. You’ll never convince a Christian that any other god is as valid as theirs, because they see all gods as cases of mistaken identity for their own. Except for the Bad Ones of course…those are The Devil. The one who somehow “rebelled” against the omnipotent God, leaving God’s hands clean for everything. Hell they couldn’t even keep the SAME god…they had to split Him up into a trinity so Germanic and Norwegian tribesmen felt a little more comfortable about the Slavemaster in the Sky. Basically, Thor himself could step down from Asgard, arm in arm with Zeus, and they’ll just say “Look! Here come two manifestations of Yaweh!” There’s no penetrating that “logic.”

    • stephen

      some ancient dude once said something like…religion is regarded by the ignorant masses as true, by wise men as false and by rulers as useful.

  • LH

    Dennis, First, I take offense in your assumption that God is male. Which groups (science and a faction from a religion based outlook that you cite) have proven intelligent design? I’d be interested to know. You also ask “what if God is real? and how would Maher react to his queries about doubting him. Well, isn’t your God all forgiving? I suspect he’d chuckle unless your God is one of those who can’t or won’t forgive, which would be a shame considering that in our Western moral construct we all are fallible. I suggest you read some history about the Greek and Roman religions. Their Gods cared and truly understood human fallacy rather than taking a ‘my way or the highway’ attitude.

  • Dennis Therrian

    How dare you say the bible is bulls**t! I thought you were an intelligent man until I heard you say that! As smart as you are, and you blow it on saying something like that! You sir are a blaspheming poor soul, and I’ll ask God to have mercy on your soul, but I doubt it! The fact that you don’t understand the possibility God is real, shows me you’re not as smart as I had previously thought! I hope you would at least believe there is a possibility there is a God, and the bible is the truth of it, even if it has been a little distorted by mans influence doesn’t mean it’s not real? Think about this for a moment; how is it, we as humans living on Earth are perfectly set away from the sun so we don’t burn, and the air we breath is held in by an atmosphere and isn’t out in space. Also, the air we breath is regenerated by what we exhale to the trees as there oxygen, and we are the only civilization in our entire solar system, and beyond what our best technology can see? Our technology can see billions of other galaxies, and yet we still haven’t saw, or been in contact with any other life forms out there? Remember in science, “you can’t get something from nothing?” Do you know science and a faction from a religion based out-look, the intelligent design team have come together to prove we are made from intelligent design? You should really look into something before you discredit what you might not understand? You’re not a Pastor anyways, right? Maybe you should take some time and find out for yourself what the possibility of life could be? Life isn’t based on what you see, but most people say and believe; if you can’t see it hear it or touch it, it doesn’t exist? We couldn’t hear or touch space for thousands of years and we didn’t even know it was there until an “EYE” was opened to see it; which was our telescope, so before you discredit something, you should really try to find out what the “REAL FACTS ARE” before you set yourself up for failure. What if God is real? What would you say to him if he asked you; “why did you say that about my word of truth and love to you and humanity?” The “WORD” was God, and was with God, so to deny his “WORD” is to deny what spoke you into existence, and to deny a part of yourself. Also you would say; “you are denying yourself as being real!” Just think about what I’m saying?…

    • Rick Knight

      Lighten up Dennis. There are so many logical fallacies in your argument that I’m not even sure where you were going. Admitting something is a “possibility” and then stating that a book written by men makes it a truth is ridiculous. Also, Intelligent Design has not, and will never be “proven.” It is based on faith and faith alone, the assumptions are tainted by bias and you know what they say about crappy data in, crappy data out.

    • I P Freely

      Dennis, do you eat a lot of lead paint?

    • http://www.facebook.com/lisa.shields.188 Lisa Shields

      Your opinion, of course.
      But to those who value the Koran, the Torah, or any other “great book of faith”, the bible is irrelevant. To them, it is mythology…no more factual than a Grimm fairy tale.

      The founding fathers believed in individual conscience…unlike you.

    • http://www.facebook.com/Punk4rmfl Jose Antonio Luis

      Dennis is a bit butt-hurt… ” I’ll ask God to have mercy on your soul, but I doubt it! The fact that you don’t understand the possibility God is real, shows me you’re not as smart as I had previously thought!” not only is it sad that you believe in the bible so strongly… It is very disappointing that you know nothing about it… Don’t insult people, don’t say negative things to people and don’t tell them that God will most likely not have mercy on their souls. In that tiny piece of what you typed you showed that you in essence have no respect for the teachings that you are complaining he knows nothing about.

      In addition to that, it’s also insulting to see that you could speak so much, basically tell him to shut up because he’s not a pastor and because he’s not a scientist when at the end of the day I doubt you’ve even finished college.

      Please, do us all a favor… Follow your own advice and go read about both science and religion. Not only is Christianity a mimic of older religions including parts of the Egyptian religions, science can easily explain why we’re so perfectly “set” here.

      We’re in the “Goldilocks zone” meaning our planet is in the perfect place to host life… They have found countless planets within what we’ve studied in the universe that are also within this zone (meaning it’s not that unlikely for it to happen) and in addition to that we’ve found microorganisms on mars which also shows that life exists elsewhere, not just on our planet.

      We’re “evolved” and although we think we’re intelligent and the product of some magical force, we’re just hairless apes that became slightly more intelligent due to the need for survival…

      I would take the “Aquatic Ape” theory where we evolved from sea apes over your “Adam and Eve” story any day…

      Mind you, your God has the temperament of a Child… He’s all loving but when he throws a tantrum he has not only flooded the world and burned cities down, he’s thrown plagues and even puts people through horrific tests just to see if they believe in him… At the end of the day, I am intelligent and educated enough to say that I can’t know whether there is or is not a God, but I can tell you that you sir are not a true Christian.

    • Ranman 57

      Uh Dennis…You’re stating “what the real facts are”, before he sets himself up for failure? What REAL facts are there that says without a DOUBT that God does exist? There is only ONE way God for SURE exists, and that’s to each individual that has the faith in themselves too believe it’s true. Just because someone says they don’t believe in God, doesn’t make them a bad person which you so presumptiously say with your statement “How dare you say the Bible is bulls–t!” Our Constitution grants each and EVERY one the right TO believe, or the right NOT to believe, without persecution. But the religious side tries so hard to push their own PERSONAL beliefs and Biblical “law” into our society, not caring or taking into consideration that a lot of people just do NOT believe..Therefore, they shouldn’t be subjected to the will or laws or beliefs of the ones who do. Remember this..ANY religions laws and beliefs applies ONLY to others who follow that SAME religion. It would be unjust AND unconstitutional to try and force it upon others. Now, you think about what I”M saying..

    • Timothy

      Look Mr. Dennis, don’t waste your time trying to convince these people that there is a God. They are all headed in the way of Christopher Hitchen who by the way has become fully convinced that there is a God. But it’s too late for him.

      • AATTP

        Who told you that? God?

        • Timothy

          The same thing that informed you of the beliefs of the founding fathers, a written document.

        • Timothy

          Dont assume all liberals are anti-God.

        • Timothy

          I see the AATTP is afraid to be challenged. You erased my comments.

          • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

            If AATTP erased the comment, I’d like them to restore it. I’ll gladly take up any challenge you make.

          • AATTP

            I just looked and see nothing that’s been deleted from Timothy.

            FYI: The only time we delete comments is if they are egregiously rude or hateful towards us or other members or call for violence (even if it’s liberals saying things like, “We should shoot Tea Partiers”). Other than that, they’re approved.

      • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

        Timothy, what a presumptuous notion, that Mr. Hitchens “has become fully convinced that there is a God. But it’s too late for him.”

        Proof??? What PROOF do you have to back your claim? NONE. As always…

        • Timothy

          God will prove himself soon enough. You will see.

          • AATTP

            Cop. Out.

        • Timothy

          If you can”t prove to me that what B Maher is saying about the beliefs of the founding fathers are true besides showing me a written document that you were not personally there to witness, then that puts you and me in the same boat. I have the written word and you have your written documents. You have no more proof than I do. lol

          • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

            Here is a collection of quotes from John Adams, George Washington, and Thomas Jefferson that prove what our founders thought of the Bible and religion in general: http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/07/04/35-founding-father-quotes-conservative-christians-will-hate/

          • RichardR

            Uhhh…no, Timothy. In the case of the founders, we have what’s referred to as “third party evidence.” That being corroboration from a source that isn’t the person who originally made the claim. Outside of the Bible, there were absolutely no corroborating reports of all the “miracles” Jesus supposedly did…and it’s not like the Romans or Jews couldn’t read or write. If even half the s**t happened that Jesus’ apostles SAID happened, don’t you think it MIGHT have made the news in Rome? No…there were no Roman reports of a guy feeding thousands with a fish and a loaf, or going around healing lepers everywhere he went, because it DIDN’T HAPPEN. Not saying Jesus didn’t exist, just saying it’s easy to make up stories about s**t that happened 1,000 miles away and 30 years after someone’s dead if nobody has Twitter.

    • RichardR

      Wow…working backward from “Earth was made for humans,” huh? Here’s a couple of thoughts, if you can use them:

      1) The Earth happens to be the third planet from the sun, and because of its distance conditions happened to be right for life to develop.

      2) If you add naturally occurring organic proteins together in the presence of heat and electricity, they will self-organize into the stuff DNA is made of. Water crystallizing into ice works the same way.

      3) Those self-organizing molecules built protective envelopes around them, and those envelopes changed to suit the conditions and create more molecules.

      4) Two molecules stuck together to share energy, and the two they divided into stuck to them as well. Multicellular life evolved from there.

      5) As the Earth changed, those organisms changed to adapt to the circumstances and stay alive. Simple cell membranes compressing in the presence of pressure became ears, light-sensitive photo-cells became eyes, mobile cilia became arms and legs.

      6) Those things got bigger, stronger, thicker, better adapted to hot and cold, able to breathe either oxygen or carbon dioxide and capable of absorbing nutrients from other organisms.

      7) Humans and all other organisms evolved to suit the environment, having come from the Earth itself.

      8) The Earth wasn’t designed for us as we are now. What we are now is a result of the Earth.

      • Timothy

        Prove it.

        • RichardR

          Pick up any book but the Bible. Prove it yourself.

          • Timothy

            No you prove it yourself. Gods truth is proven everytime you breath.

        • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

          Look, Timothy, you’re just being an ass now. Your inability to think critically is too much. It is impossible to have a logical discussion with you because you don’t even know what logic is, nevermind how to employ it. You make outrageous claims, like “God will show himself, just wait and see” as if we humans haven’t waited for thousands of years already and.. nothing. Not now, not then, not ever. So shut up unless you have something logical to contribute. Your illogical and childish outbursts are insulting to the rest of us.

          • Timothy

            Let me ask you one logical question in order to prove who is not thinking critical. You ask me to prove Jesus existed. Well I have the book of documents in my hand to prove it. It’s the only proof I have for you. Now.I want you or anyone of your friends to tell me what method will you use to prove Bill Mahers statement that the founding fathers thought the Bible was BS. As a matter of fact how will you prove they existed at all? Give me your method Sherlock.

          • http://nomoremythology.wordpress.com No More Mythology

            Tim, the bible is the CLAIM, not the PROOF. The fact is that Jesus isn’t mentioned by any historical reference for the first 100 years after his alleged death and resurrection; and the first “historian” to mention Jesus did so referring to the bible, which is the claim, not the proof. The fact is that the bible claims that when Jesus was resurrected, so were hundreds of “saints”, yet not a single contemporary of the day records the event except for the Bible, which fact itself suggests that the events claimed didn’t happen.

            I’ll reiterate once more: The Bible is the CLAIM. Where’s the PROOF?

          • RichardR

            @ NMM: Man, you’re talking to a Teabagger and a Christian. Far as they’re concerned, the claim IS the proof.

          • Timothy

            The claim, not the proof. LOL. You just made that up. You never answered my question. How will you prove Bill Mahers statements? BTW I’m sure I am an insult though I don’t mean to be. I am just challenging you argument with “logic.” I

        • RichardR

          “No you prove it yourself. Gods truth is proven everytime you breath.” So are farts. Just because you can redefine God to try to prove a point doesn’t make me wrong. The things I say I say because we’ve observed them to be true…you’re starting from an unprovable position, so the burden is on YOU to prove your assertions. I don’t need to prove anything, because everything I’m saying is reasonable, self-evident, and doesn’t require any suspension of reason to understand. Faith-based reason isn’t reason at all…it’s just witchcraft and convenient superstition.

          • Timothy

            Do you honestly think that those few sentences you wrote proves anything? Be for real bro. Life and its origins are far more complicated than that. Plus you pretending as if you have found the answer to questions dating back long before us is laughable at best. Who do you think you are fooling?

        • RichardR

          “Do you honestly think that those few sentences you wrote proves anything?” No, because they don’t need to. Trying to explain cause and effect to someone who believes that there’s only one cause for everything is pointless. Faith is the deliberate suspension of reason, so I could take you back in a time machine and show you the evolution of Earth, and you wouldn’t believe your own eyes because you choose to blind yourself with a comforting fiction. You’d rather believe that humans are intrinsically special, anointed by God, because you can’t accept the fact that YOU’RE not special without some ridiculous sense of divinity. You can’t be just another animal on a rock. Poor baby is too scared to feel like Space Daddy isn’t looking out for him, because Space Daddy doesn’t give a damn about a bunch of monkeys on a rock. So don’t pretend like your fear or need to feel special and beloved justifies anything, or proves anything, or means anything to anybody but you. At least I have logic on my side…all you have is the comforting fiction that your life means something wonderful just because you’re God’s special little Space Monkey.

          • Timothy

            You cant even explain the method by which you’ve come to your conclusions yet you claim that logic is on your side. Well you may be right. Logic is on your side, human logic.You, as we all were at some point are flawed by nature. The scripture tells us in Galatians 5:17 that the the flesh(human sin nature) sets its desire against the Spirit(God) and the Spirit against the flesh. Your mind is stuck on human logic because you can’t even fathom the fact that divine revelation can even possibly be true so you set your desires against anything that reminds you that THERE IS A GOD IN HEAVEN. Actually I do understand that it takes a work of God to raise your ability to see that there is more to life than humans can even fathom without the help of the Spirit of God.So you can keep your space capsule bro, because even if you had one it couldn’t take you no higher than the limit the Spirit has placed on it. To get where I am you need divine help from the Spirit of God, not space capsules. I understand that perfectly.

        • RichardR

          Lol…That’s the point I’m attempting to make with you. I wouldn’t have to explain “the method by which I’ve come to my conclusions” to somebody who actually understood the concept of logic. I’m not going to explain the concept of “reason” to you, though you obviously need somebody to. I just don’t have the patience to explain how thought works on a fifth grade level. But suffice it to say, the difference between “logic” and “faith” is that one relies on drawing conclusions from observations about the world, and the other involves ignoring observations about the real world so you can believe what you want to.

          Dude, don’t preach to me about the Bible and “divine knowledge.” I was raised with Christians, and I’ve read the bible cover-to-cover more than once. You know, cover-to-cover…not just the verses that support what I already want to believe. And you know what I realized about the Bible? It’s a good book, but it’s still just a book. It’s a story with a beginning, a middle and an end. But it’s just a book, and I’ve read better and more believable ones. And I didn’t need to believe in magic or “divine knowledge” to understand them. The Bible is the only book I’ve ever seen aside from preschool childrens’ books that requires you to completely abandon all concepts of logic and reason to get on its level.

          Matter of fact, truth be told, I WAS a believer until I actually read the whole book for the first time. That was when I realized that it was basically just the story of a bronze-age cult that stuck around for a while because it invaded a peaceful land, killed everyone who lived there and took over because “God” had decided they had a right to do it. Sounds like every other justification for genocide I’ve ever heard. I don’t care what you say about the Bible…it’s nothing but the history of a violent people deluded into believing they were right by a group of people who needed the fear of God to stay in charge. And it’s still true, but now they hold Revelations over your head and tell you to abandon all hope and get ready for The End.

          Anyway, I’m done talking to you. I don’t have time to go on a rant with someone who doesn’t believe in the concept of human logic. If you believe that magic Sky Man is going to shower you with more wisdom than you can achieve with your own brain, then continue ignoring reality and talk to him. I’m done with you.

          • Timothy

            And I am an associate minister and theology student who has studied the bible academically from cover to cover. But like “God” says “my sheep will hear my voice.” You have many people who have read from cover to cover and still dont get it. Why? Because they dont belong to Him. I guess you dont belong to Him.Too bad. There is still hope for you though because you are still breathing.

          • AATTP
          • RichardR

            @ AATP: Re: The video. Lol…dude. Harsh.

        • RichardR

          “Only God’s sheep will hear the voice of God?” So, basically, you’re saying that only people who believe in God will find evidence of God. That you have to decide to believe in something before you can believe in it. Like Tinkerbell. Well, I’d say that about sums it up then.

    • stephen

      What would you say to him if he asked you; “why did you say that about my word of truth and love to you and humanity?” “He” the big man in the sky with the long white beard would never ask me that question. He’s God. He already knows my heart and mind. Silly.

    • vaffangool

      Think about this for a moment; how is it, we as humans living on Earth are perfectly set away from the sun so we don’t burn, and the air we breath is held in by an atmosphere and isn’t out in space. Also, the air we breath is regenerated by what we exhale to the trees as there oxygen, and we are the only civilization in our entire solar system, and beyond what our best technology can see?

      Are you really that fucking stupid? Those conditions weren’t created in order to accomodate our existence–our existence is a byproduct of those conditions.

      You have to be absolutely insane to believe those conditions were created by a deity interested in our comfort. You have no business commenting on the intelligence of another–you are an authority on nothing but categorical lunacy.

    • Highlander

      WOW, intelligent Design? You do know that is not actually science right? No matter how much Ken Ham and his ilk repeat it ad nauseum, it will never be a science. Anyone that tells you different is either ignorant of science, or selling you something.

Scroll To Top
website security Website Security Test